Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

What works and what doesn't. Share design ideas, references and contacts for paipo board builders.

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby nomastomas » Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:15 pm

OK... one out of how many bodyboard producers?
krusher74 wrote:...This is technology is achieved by an AKU shaping machine, using process’ derived from the surfboard industry."
Yes, of course...doing one by hand would be exceptionally labor-intensive. That's the first I've heard of a bodyboard blank being machine cut. I wonder if the entire shape is CNC'd? Marko makes a foam called "iFoam", which is a secret mixture of EPP and EPS foams (said to be used in car bumpers) It is incredibly resilient. I would never attempt to hand-shape a board using iFoam. Finish shaping a machined iFoam blank is hard enough, even with a "high-resolution" cut. I once had an order for a swallow tail shape in iFoam. Aku is unable to cut swallow-tails, so it has to be cut out and finished after machining. Cutting the tail wasn't so difficult but finishing and contouring the wings was. After several unsuccessful attempts with a variety of shaping tools, I finally grabbed my 7" sander and attacked the tail. I finally started to see some results. I use a technique learned from watching my glasser sand surfboard rails; gun the disk, take your finger off the trigger and stroke the area needing sanding. The friction from the abrasion naturally slows the speed of the disk and prevents over-sanding. On one stroke, my timing was a little off and I was still pulling the trigger when the disk hit the spot I was working on, causing the disk to grab and skip across the deck. That would have been close to catastrophic on any other foam. But the errant disk just skipped across the deck without doing any damage. As I said, incredibly resilient.
"This is a paipo site...isn't it?"
www.tp4surf.com
User avatar
nomastomas
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 459
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Ojai, CA
City: Ojai
State or Province: CA
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby krusher74 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 2:50 am

nomastomas wrote:OK... one out of how many bodyboard producers?
krusher74 wrote:...This is technology is achieved by an AKU shaping machine, using process’ derived from the surfboard industry."
Yes, of course...doing one by hand would be exceptionally labor-intensive. That's the first I've heard of a bodyboard blank being machine cut. I wonder if the entire shape is CNC'd? Marko makes a foam called "iFoam", which is a secret mixture of EPP and EPS foams (said to be used in car bumpers) It is incredibly resilient. I would never attempt to hand-shape a board using iFoam. Finish shaping a machined iFoam blank is hard enough, even with a "high-resolution" cut. I once had an order for a swallow tail shape in iFoam. Aku is unable to cut swallow-tails, so it has to be cut out and finished after machining. Cutting the tail wasn't so difficult but finishing and contouring the wings was. After several unsuccessful attempts with a variety of shaping tools, I finally grabbed my 7" sander and attacked the tail. I finally started to see some results. I use a technique learned from watching my glasser sand surfboard rails; gun the disk, take your finger off the trigger and stroke the area needing sanding. The friction from the abrasion naturally slows the speed of the disk and prevents over-sanding. On one stroke, my timing was a little off and I was still pulling the trigger when the disk hit the spot I was working on, causing the disk to grab and skip across the deck. That would have been close to catastrophic on any other foam. But the errant disk just skipped across the deck without doing any damage. As I said, incredibly resilient.


Apart from a few custom shapers round the world, 90% plus of the board come out of the nick mezrik (NMD) factory in Java. they make all the major brands boards, and seem to do all the R&D too, so unless they invent something new the boards just stay the same.

They are using the CNC shaping to do the latest quad channel , its funny because if you look at every major brads catalogue this year they all have a "version" of that same quad channel board.

See how many of the same board by "different" companies you can spot https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=bodyb ... 34#imgrc=_
User avatar
krusher74
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 725
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:53 pm
Location: Wales UK, (Sometimes cali in the winters)
City: swansea
State or Province: wales
Country: united kingdom

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby nomastomas » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:47 am

Great insight, Keith...Well, that pretty much explains the lack of progression in design and the "generic" quality of the industry as a whole.
"This is a paipo site...isn't it?"
www.tp4surf.com
User avatar
nomastomas
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 459
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Ojai, CA
City: Ojai
State or Province: CA
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby GeoffreyLevens » Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:57 am

If iFoam is same or similar to what I bought about 25 years ago, shaped in keels and concave paipo, it has tremendous float and really is bomb proof. Shape it and ride it, no sealing or coating of any sort needed. The outfit I bought the board from has long since vanished by the called it "automobile bumper foam". Extremely light weight too.
GeoffreyLevens
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 346
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:58 am
Location: Paonia, Colorado
City: Paonia
State or Province: Colorado
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby nomastomas » Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:52 am

iFoam is described as a "closed cell" foam that resists intrusion by a liquid (both water and resin) I think water intrusion is a relative thing, with some foams (notably EPS) drawing in liquids more than others. I've shaped probably half a dozen iFoam blanks and I wouldn't attempt to use it in the water without at least a resin sealer coat. A sanded finished iFoam blank has this odd "fuzzy" quality which I believe are pieces of the EPP foam. The other problem is the EPS foam component which is notorious for liquid absorption (note: higher density EPS less susceptible, "pressure-molded" less susceptible; slab-cut, 1.5lb density most susceptible) If the board you described was "molded" (a.k.a pop out) then it probably had a thin skin or crust on the surface which is an artifact of the molding process. All foams created in molds, either from poured chemical mixtures or pressure-ized beads, have crusts. But...a sealed iFoam blank just might work....(wheels turning)
"This is a paipo site...isn't it?"
www.tp4surf.com
User avatar
nomastomas
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 459
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Ojai, CA
City: Ojai
State or Province: CA
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby krusher74 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:59 am

GeoffreyLevens wrote:If iFoam is same or similar to what I bought about 25 years ago, shaped in keels and concave paipo, it has tremendous float and really is bomb proof. Shape it and ride it, no sealing or coating of any sort needed. The outfit I bought the board from has long since vanished by the called it "automobile bumper foam". Extremely light weight too.


On the subject of foam, bodyboards use two different foams PE (polyethylene) cheaper boards which soaks in water. and higher end PP (polypropylene) with is non water absorbent (super cheap boards are EPS expanded polystyrene but the there the sup $50 board that should be totally avoided)
User avatar
krusher74
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 725
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:53 pm
Location: Wales UK, (Sometimes cali in the winters)
City: swansea
State or Province: wales
Country: united kingdom

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby krusher74 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 2:00 am

User avatar
krusher74
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 725
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:53 pm
Location: Wales UK, (Sometimes cali in the winters)
City: swansea
State or Province: wales
Country: united kingdom

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby CHRISPI » Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:25 am

I thought my boards were weird
CHRISPI
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 273
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2014 2:48 pm
City: Durban
State or Province: Natals
Country: South Africa

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby SURFFOILS » Wed Jun 27, 2018 6:56 am

Your boards are amazing Chrispi !
------------------------------------------------------------------
surffoil@gmail.com
SURFFOILS
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 154
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 5:07 am
City: Gold Coast
State or Province: Qld
Country: Australia

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby rodndtube » Wed Jun 27, 2018 9:26 am

I see that Webs (aka paddling gloves) were on the list. I love them! And Webs were the best made of the lot. Today's paddling gloves, mostly H2O, have a nice family of warm water (finger tipless) to cooler water versions (thicker mm), but the production quality is very poor and the hand/fingers layout isn't much better. Most also have an advantage in addition to paddling and that is board gripping power and reef/rock protection (but not sea urchins penetration prevention!).

Having said that, I don't use my arms to routinely paddle out to the reefs, mostly just my swim fins/legs. Gloves are not a huge factor for me in catching waves as I rely mostly upon positioning rather than paddling like a longboarder to catch a wave. Gloves do come in handy for those sprints to get outside during ghost sets.
rodNDtube
"Prone to ride"
I love my papa li`ili`i

"The sea doth wash away all human ills."
-- Euripides.
User avatar
rodndtube
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 986
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2011 10:34 pm
Location: Maryland, USA & Where the Waves Are Breaking
City: Arbutus Land
State or Province: Maryland
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby krusher74 » Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:02 am

User avatar
krusher74
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 725
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:53 pm
Location: Wales UK, (Sometimes cali in the winters)
City: swansea
State or Province: wales
Country: united kingdom

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby nomastomas » Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:37 am

Great find, Keith...really interesting stuff. One of my early Boogies (maybe a "Comp" model?) was blue with the red and white layered rail. I didn't realize that was functional, only thought it was decorative. It was a major improvement over the first models which were super flexy. I added the twin keel fin kit to that board, and never went back to finless.
"This is a paipo site...isn't it?"
www.tp4surf.com
User avatar
nomastomas
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 459
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Ojai, CA
City: Ojai
State or Province: CA
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby rodndtube » Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:53 am

Fascinating read.
rodNDtube
"Prone to ride"
I love my papa li`ili`i

"The sea doth wash away all human ills."
-- Euripides.
User avatar
rodndtube
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 986
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2011 10:34 pm
Location: Maryland, USA & Where the Waves Are Breaking
City: Arbutus Land
State or Province: Maryland
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby Nels » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:45 am

That was indeed a fun read. I interviewed down there at the Roosevelt St. factory back in that era, 1978 if I remember correctly. I was looking for some kind of sales thing, had the interview set up, made the long drive down from Ventura County for an 8 a.m. interview with Clark Cederval (sp?)...had to wait a bit while they wrapped up a sale of some Doyles to some Waikiki beach boy business. The main guy of the two looked like Rabbit Kekai but I remember the guy talking about sealing the deal so they could get on the golf course, so...???

Clark gave me the tour but told me that Morey and Doyle had gone to San Francisco the week before and sold the company. No job materialized. Kransco, however, did a really good job promoting the boards. They launched a period of very inclusive contests and beach days, and were very professional in their dealings with media. Good times.

Nels
Nels
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 194
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:58 pm
City: Camarillo
State or Province: California
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby CHRISPI » Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:12 pm

WOW very interesting top post
CHRISPI
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 273
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2014 2:48 pm
City: Durban
State or Province: Natals
Country: South Africa

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby krusher74 » Sun Jul 15, 2018 9:01 am

So after bodyboards having very little changes in hull design since i have been riding them for 25 years there seems to be a "new design" on the block. I'm seems pretty much every board company (since most of them come out of the same factory) have added a quad channel to thier line up.

But interesting I have seen very little sales blurb as to what it can do for a ride. faster? turn harder?

So today I thought I would see what i could find. found this :shock:

QUAD CONCAVE

As for the newly introduced Quad Concave. Paralleled with its release we saw a series of convoluted words in explanation as to the physics behind the idea. Leaving even the best of us with clouded interpretations. Now, to put it simply, the inner two concaves’ run within the confines of the already implemented PFS3 system, once again aiding in maximising centred water flow. Additionally, having those extra inner concaves’ allows the rider to draw a higher line and exert more power into the bottom turn.
The outer concaves’ complimented by the PFS3 system draws water down the full length of the rail creating a focused and powerful bottom turn as the water passes the entire length of the board. The Quad Concave in terms of rail to rail surfing is perhaps the most powerful option to ever be ran as a stock board.

WI-FLY

The Wi-Fly tail actually cuts an entire inch off the full length of your extended rail. By cutting the tail back in a diagonal catch you’re cutting the length and effectively cutting any extra need for control. Although only an inch down you’re going to find a huge change in terms of control of the board. Bottom turning, carving and spinning is about to become a whole lot easier with a tail that releases with an inch less of grab

any opinions? :?
Attachments
quad.jpg
User avatar
krusher74
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 725
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:53 pm
Location: Wales UK, (Sometimes cali in the winters)
City: swansea
State or Province: wales
Country: united kingdom

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby krusher74 » Tue Jul 17, 2018 1:53 pm

nice video showing if your gonna surf like this I dont think a hard board is an option :?

https://vimeo.com/280147307?ref=fb-share&1
User avatar
krusher74
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 725
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:53 pm
Location: Wales UK, (Sometimes cali in the winters)
City: swansea
State or Province: wales
Country: united kingdom

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby Nels » Tue Jul 17, 2018 8:35 pm

That was a really nice video. It looked like some advanced use of legs and swimfins in some of the early waves that were large and critical. Maybe everybody does it. I've never seen any photos or footage of myself and things move fast in the water so who knows.

The guy made a comment about "getting inspiration from surfing"...that always bugs the crap out of me...for me it's ALL surfing. I've never seen it any other way but I give up on the general wave-riding public and culture.
Nels
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 194
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:58 pm
City: Camarillo
State or Province: California
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby nomastomas » Tue Jul 17, 2018 9:15 pm

Leg/fin dragging is a good example of drag applied in the service of control....The Waikiki beach boys use to drag their feet to initiate a turn on their skeg-less paddle boards, modern SUPers and surf kayakers drag their paddles for a similar reason.
"This is a paipo site...isn't it?"
www.tp4surf.com
User avatar
nomastomas
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 459
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Ojai, CA
City: Ojai
State or Province: CA
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby GeoffreyLevens » Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:35 am

Beautiful camera work to me. Must admit I"m not a fan of the GoPro POV stuff, esp in tiny surf where you can't really seem much of anything. This though, made me happy just watching

Interesting wave I think at 4:24 where only contact points w/ board are hands and a very small area of his inside hip. Almost like giant handplane or something
GeoffreyLevens
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 346
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:58 am
Location: Paonia, Colorado
City: Paonia
State or Province: Colorado
Country: USA

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby krusher74 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:46 pm

GeoffreyLevens wrote:Beautiful camera work to me. Must admit I"m not a fan of the GoPro POV stuff, esp in tiny surf where you can't really seem much of anything. This though, made me happy just watching

Interesting wave I think at 4:24 where only contact points w/ board are hands and a very small area of his inside hip. Almost like giant handplane or something


Yeah i hate the gopro and it stupid mega wide angle, good for barrel stills but thats it.
User avatar
krusher74
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 725
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:53 pm
Location: Wales UK, (Sometimes cali in the winters)
City: swansea
State or Province: wales
Country: united kingdom

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby zensuni » Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:22 am

Great video indeed, the power generated by these huge tubing waves seems so hard to handle on a skegless board, and yet he manages to do it.
In small waves one would slightly drag a flipper in the water to increase control, this guy in these powerfull waves drags the entire legs :lol:
User avatar
zensuni
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2016 3:58 pm
City: Bordeaux
State or Province: Aquitaine
Country: France

Re: Bodyboards discuss (the soft paipo)

Unread postby zensuni » Tue Aug 07, 2018 1:06 am

This board might be a fun soft paipo.
It is a soft top, it is finless, it has quite an alaia shape, could be a fun subtitute to an alaia when it is small.
The model is seaglass albacore.
seaglass_albacore_56.jpg
User avatar
zensuni
Big Wave Charger
 
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2016 3:58 pm
City: Bordeaux
State or Province: Aquitaine
Country: France

Next

Return to Paipo Board Design & Building

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest