My lates Wing board

What works and what doesn't. Share design ideas, references and contacts for paipo board builders.
CHRISPI
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by CHRISPI » Fri Mar 20, 2015 6:10 am

Interesting kite board looks like something you were working on.Interpriting performance information from a surf session is ambiguous at best, conditions are never the same especially on sand beach breaks a perfect sand bar can wash away in hours and never seen again for years. I look forward to testing on a hydraulic wave pool one day, you could do back to back tests without the variables, video would be much simpler without the long view shots on the sea

SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Tue Mar 24, 2015 11:29 pm

A wave pool would be perfect for testing hydrofoils, what say we all meet in the Phillipines next year for 3 months of testing ? :D
Here's my Board of the Day !. Found in a cleanup, it's just ply but looks to be from the 60's or earlier. I gave it a few coats of epoxy and took it out today.
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Neutral bouyancy, hard getting onto a wave, but quick across the face. It's a great old board becuase it's old but design and materials have progressed so much that this one just isnt in the race.

Here's the foil board getting the deck veneer vacced on. Innegra under the veneer and 6 oz over the top. Should be bulletproof.
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krusher74
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by krusher74 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 5:15 am

CHRISPI wrote:Coordinating a video shot for the surf is as challenging as making the board, to get a camera and a competent surf savvy cameraman together on a good day with good light is a challenge, the unemployed can’t afford pro camera crews. But I am working on it
I'm happy if we end up meeting up on my trip to SA to get some footage of you :D

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krusher74
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by krusher74 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 5:25 am

On the subject of wave pools were actually getting the worlds first commercial one here in little old wales! :lol:

I had never though out it till you mentioned testing, but i wonder if companys worldwide will start to do scientific board testing there. :o

http://www.surfsnowdonia.co.uk/

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bgreen
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by bgreen » Wed Mar 25, 2015 6:01 am

Brett,

Good to see you about. Hope things are ok.
Do you recall the address where you found the board? Interesting to find out about the board.

Bob

CHRISPI
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by CHRISPI » Wed Mar 25, 2015 12:02 pm

It looks like the pool in Wales is going to be one of the most powerful hydraulic waves around; the hype makes it sound exciting, 3 months in the Philippines sounds even more exciting. I must start taking the lotto again, or sell some boats. I was talking to a Durban surf board shaper, He told me they are vacuum bagging thin airex core foam onto xps boards to make them more delimitation proof, ding resistant and less likely to snap, He says it takes am extra 45 min to wrap and bag a board, the foam wraps around the rails , its glassed normally over the Airex
Last edited by CHRISPI on Wed Mar 25, 2015 12:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CHRISPI
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by CHRISPI » Wed Mar 25, 2015 12:16 pm

Keith keep in contact about when and where you are planning to go .your camera people make you look good, your posted shots show you perfectly slotted every time it takes huge dedication, concentration and skill to get pics like that . I hope you appreciate them? At least a pint for every in the slot shot

SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:16 pm

Vac bagging is the way to go esp for prone boards. Put the foam shape with wet glass in a bag and attach a vacuum hose and in a few hours it's set, flat, and the vacuum sucks away excess resin so it's as light as possible.
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Bob, I'd go back and show them the board but I'm afraid they would want it back !
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CHRISPI
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by CHRISPI » Thu Mar 26, 2015 6:23 am

I must start vac bagging, I have a old devilbis compressor maybe I can reverse the valve body and turn it into a vacuum pump

SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Thu Mar 26, 2015 6:50 am

That's the frustration of the Internet, I can tell you how to do it but if I could show you, you'd pick it up instantly.
Vacbagging is simple but you've got to have the pump and a few bits and then it all gets so easy to glass anything.
I bought a pump off ebay but I've heard of people using fish tank pumps...
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Wooddave
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by Wooddave » Thu Mar 26, 2015 9:07 am

I've been looking into which route to take with the vacuum pumps..
The aquarium pump is cheap and quiet,but the conversion on the new model of the tetra pump worries me a bit..
The rotary vane like the one you have is reliable but loud and puts out an oil vapor,,
I'm trying to decide whether or not it's worth it to get a gast pump from ebay, it is a large diaphragm pump used in the medical field and is basically a very large aquarium pump with the output already reversed..
Brett, What do you use as a breather for peel ply and what do you use to absorb the excess resin ?

SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Thu Mar 26, 2015 4:15 pm

Dave, for breather ply I found some floor mat material that does both jobs, it's cheap and after each board I throw it away.
If the jobs small like fins the excess resin gets pulled into the tube and when it's set I squeeze the tube and the resin falls out. I've also got a fine filter on the end of the hose so resin doesn't go to the pump.
Ill get some pics later today and add to this post.
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by Wooddave » Thu Mar 26, 2015 7:15 pm

Thanks Brett,
Any pics you could post of your setup would be nice.
I'm no longer working for the composite preform company so my scrap supplies are dwindling.
It's better to have a setup that I can use at home anyway and cheap is good..
There's been an older used diaphragm pump listed locally here on craigslist for a few days I think I might give them a call.

SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Thu Mar 26, 2015 9:54 pm

Board of the day... Morey The One, but it's not. The added fin system isn't The One either.
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Dave, here's a pic of the filter I use on the tubing, I can easily post you a dozen, I use one for months and change it whenever. I'll do more pics over the next few days.
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SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:06 am

Here's pics of my basic vac pump setup, there's the pump, two tubes, a filter and a gauge.

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SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:22 am

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So looking from the bottom pic on up, the White tube is perforated and sits inside the bag with the blank / glass. It sucks the air out of the bag from all around the blank and then into the filter.
The filter is important to place next so that any resin drops , mist, whatever doesn't make it up to the gauge ot further.
The Guage is suited to the pump, there's an absolute value for the perfect vacuum but we're not interested in breaking any records, applying 'measured' vacuum is the game.
Why 'measured' vacuum and not full bore ?
Becuase too low a vacuum and the glass and resin aren't drawn onto the blank firmly and excess resin drawn away. Too high a vacuum and the blank can be crushed or twisted becuase it's foam, not steel.
Once the air is drawn our of the bag by the perforated tube, filtered thru the filter, measured by the Guage, it's drawn into the pump and there is a fine oil mist that emanates from this type of pump so it needs to be positioned where the mist can blow outside.
The best bag to use is a polyethylene bag of whatever size that suits your application or you can tape two together. If you know what an OTTO bin is you can use OTTO bin liners, they'll cost you about 50c each.
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CHRISPI
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by CHRISPI » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:22 pm

Hi Brett,
I want to convert a 2hp twin cyl compressor into a vac pump, and use the pressure vessel as a vac reservoir .Do the vac bags leak much must the pump run all the curing time, it’s noisy and costly to run a 2hp for long. I plan to run a vacuum in the receiver switch the compressor off, and use the reserve vac. I appreciate all the cost cutting tips I have to keep an eye on expenses.I must try the compressor it won’t cost much to try.How much vac are you useing

SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Tue Mar 31, 2015 6:50 am

Chris, some of the pro vac guys use a cutoff switch that senses the vacuum and switches the pump on and off to save energy. It's something I've not followed up on.
The bags give an airtight seal with a few wraps of tape around the top , just be careful of any sharps as the vacuum suffers greatly even with a pinprick.Keep spare tape around to fix holes !
Even with a good seal it seems the pump needs to run to maintain the negative pressure. With epoxy it cures in 2/3/4 hours and it's like concrete. Luckily Australian weather can be temperature hot even in winter so curing resin or humidity isn't a problem.
As for pressures, on hy Guage I take it to th green line for light glassing jobs, the yellow line for a whole side of 6 oz on a surfboard and to the red line for veneers or high tech stuff with multi layers and complex curves where I need it to get it right on the first go.
So there is a level of vacuum that suits certain jobs.
image.jpg
I'm always happy to help further, if you need filters or whatever. What size dins) of vacuum builds are you anticipating ??
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CHRISPI
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by CHRISPI » Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:17 pm

Brett, I want to vacuum Airex foam onto body board size XPS , and build lighter foils. The product names from over there don’t seem to match ours; I must first build the vac pump from my junk pile, I am intrigued with this airex foam. The possibilities with strong thin laments with good flotation is interesting. A traditional thin paipo board done in an Airex lament would sort the low bouncy complaints of wood but retain that flat thin rail glide they have

SURFFOILS
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Re: My lates Wing board

Unread post by SURFFOILS » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:20 pm

Is Airex the boat building foam ? I've heard the name but can't place it....
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